Hi10P videos not working with some apps

Hi there

I'm using K-lite 18.0.0 standard on one of my new machines (which got win11),
In my old machine (which had windows 7) I've managed to open Hi10P/10bit videos in some app such as MS movie maker,
I had to disabled the 32 bit ver of MS DTV DVD video decoader on 64 bit OS in order for the apps to use the 64 bit ver of the decadoer or else the vids won't load there,

Now when I'm trying to load 10 bit vids on the win11 machine in apps such movie maker, it won't load them well even if the MS DTV DVD video decoader 32 bit ver is disabled,
Idk what K-lite changed between vers or if it's on windows end, but I was wondering if there's a way to make 10 bit videos to be loadable in some apps with the last K-lite ver?

Just to note, 10 bits vids work fine with MPC and some other video players,
It's just apps such as movie maker that can't load them for some reason, but in my old machine 10 bit vids loads on such apps just fine while using K-lite (also when I've used CCCP long before that when 10 bit just came around around 13 years ago).

Test if it correctly loads LAV Video Decoder when using the GraphStudioNext tool.

Maybe you got a newer version of Movie Maker that no longer uses DirectShow? The newer MS apps all use its own Media Foundation decoder. That is also why it is a bad idea to disable the MS codecs, as it may break other apps. On Windows 7 that was less of a problem.

It's the Movie maker that comes with Windows Live Essentials 2012, I think you can download it from here
Not sure if there was anything that came after it aside from MS editior which is something else entirely,

I'm not familiar with GraphStudioNext tool, how do I even test if an app is load a decoder with it?

GraphStudioNext shows which DirectShow filters a basic DirectShow application will use. It also has ability to connect to a remove graph (File menu). Then it shows what another app uses, but the app must support that ability, and of course be using DirectShow.

I am not going to install old Windows Live crap.

I don't really sure how to use it, I've tried loading the video with it and that's what it show,
Tried to load Movie Maker with it and didn't knew what to do from there, it only showed the Movie maker without any codecs,
Do I need to add the same codec the video showed and connect it to the movie maker output or something?

Convert your file to 8-bit with Handbrake.
https://www.handbrake.fr

Or use some other free video editor:
https://www.openshot.org/
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/davinciresolve
https://www.shotcut.org/
https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9MVFQ4LMZ6C9?hl=en-us&gl=US
http://www.videosoftdev.com/free-video-editor

I mostly want the apps to be able to read it as is rather than convert it,
I'm not using Movie maker as main editor but that ver of MM was the best and in older OS I could open the same video there using K-lite,
If I lack some codec or have some setting that prevent it from working on some apps I want to add it back/change it if possible

Movie Maker always had issues with uncommon video formats.

It is not just a matter of installing extra codecs, because you already have all that is needed. It likely has artificial limitations build in.

You could try unchecking all 10/16-bit colorspaces in LAV Video Decoder. Maybe that helps. Although it normally already should offer all available colorspaces to the downstream filter.

I can try unchecking them (the ones in the pic right?)

But won't it break other stuff from working?

Also sorry if I'm going back to the start of the post or doubt your word, but are you sure it's not a matter of missing codec and just some artificial limitation on windoes 11 side?
In Win7 the same apps worked fine with same K-lite ver so I just want to confirme that part.

Yes, those.

Windows 7 didn't use Media Foundation for .mkv playback, but Windows 11 does. So Movie Maker maybe now refuses to use DirectShow.

Movie Maker is a black box. I have no idea what exactly it does and why it may fail.

I see, I've tried to turn them off (only for the LVA video decoder, I didn't touched the LVA video decoder (MPC-HC) since from the name I've got it's just for MPC)
It didn't seem to work though,

When using Movie Maker I can see it use the LVA video and audio decoders thx to their tray bar icons, but no idea what prevent it from showing up the video, the audio does work though.

Black video screen can be issue with the video renderer.

Does normal 8-bit video display correctly?

Yeah, or at least any other non obvious 10 vids I've tried showed up so far fine,
I gave a try to two 10 bit videos and saw they show black screen (which I was familiar with from win7 days, but in win7 I found ways to make it work like the method I've stated above)

Also uncheck YV24 and RGB32/RGB24.
Might help if video is Hi10p 4:4:4 instead of 4:2:0.

Didn't helped as well :/

I should probably also mention that I've tried before to convert the video using Movie maker too and it also came out with no image (black screen) but still had audio.

I think you should find a replacement for Movie Maker.

I mean Movie Maker wasn't my main app for years either way,
But it sometime saved me time doing some stuff that even Premiere would make me take extra actions for,
And was my way to indicate that 10bit codecs works with 3rd party apps (for win7/8 that it)

You're saying that it's only Movie Maker thingy that don't want to read 10 bits rather than other apps so in this regard I'm ok with,
But I sure wish it would've work with them too, back on the 32bit days where I've used CCCP over K-lite and 10 bit just came out, I recall I had to go to the Haali Media Splitter settings and set it to use custom media type for H.264 in order for the Movie maker to work,
Then on 64 bit (around the time Haali wasn't used by then or having its settings to work custom media type for H.264 On by default) I had to disabled the 32 bit ver of MS DTV DVD video decoader via the codec tweaker for it to work,
Actually at this point I probably used the tweaker to merit codecs over all of that but can't recall.

It's hard for me to believe there's no workaround for it this time around too, but it's sure hard figuring out this blackbox when you have zero knowledge in coding.

That custom mediatype setting in Haali was to bypass the preferred filter settings of Windows.
K-Lite uses a better universal solution by actually adjusting the preferred filters to use LAV Video Decoder.
And since LAV is correctly being loaded for you, the problem is not related to decoding.

And by adjusting the output colorspace, your 10-bit video effectively becomes just regular 8-bit from point of view of renderer. Maybe the video has unusual size?

The installer has an option to change system default renderer from VMR-7 to VMR-9. Maybe that helps. But usually that is for solved issues where all video is black. And I suspect that Movie maker user EVR as renderer.

The video size is quite small actually,

I won't mind to try changing the render method just to test it out assuming it's reversible,
It must be done via the installer though? or the codec tweak tool got the option as well?

Installer only

I will give it a try on my second machine just to be safe and post if it work then~

You can also do it manually.

GraphStudioNext menu > Graph > Insert Filter > Video Mixing Renderer 9 > Change Merit

Use MERIT_PREFERRED+2 to make Windows use VMR9 instead of VMR7.

To restore system default use MERIT_DO_NOT_USE.

Do it in both 32-bit and 64-bit GraphStudioNext. Movie Maker is probably 64-bit.

I've gave both methods a try, did the installer first and then saw your second comment about do it manually,
I've did the installer first and saw it didn't work, so I've used the installer again and unchecked the VMR9 option

Then I've went into GraphStudioNext (both 32 and 64) and tried it too, and it didn't worked,
One thing that I've noticed though was that the default wasn't MERIT_DO_NOT_USE but rather MERIT_PREFERRED+1
Could be that it was the case since I didn't re-logged in or restert the PC after unchecking the VMR9 option in the installer but might was windows 11 new default after some updates,

I did restart after doing the GraphStudioNext changes to test things out though, and as you suspected it didn't worked on Movie maker,
Is there any test I could do using GraphStudioNext which could help me narrow down what might be the cause?

I am out of ideas.

I see :/

Thank for your time either way o/